i want to install a dual battery

iguana · Post by **iguana** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 7:29 pm

Just to answer you and please do not reply back, we need the dual battery thread to go on to have some useful information instead of information about Surfer and his fishing ....

There are few who hijack here and there, I sometime do this as well .. But we don't make it a long story with qouting and general discussion .... I told you before, there is no harm to put a nice comment or a joke here and there, but don't route the thread ito different way ...... Just to let you understand what happened ... Jeep was asking for something .. he had some answers, then bulldozer started with a comment, Jeep answered, you came with a comment, bulldozer answered, then jeep went and also answered the comment, then I said stop hijacking, you got angry and asked me why .. and I am now answering because I don't want you to get angry because I respect you ... I think bulldozer will answer back about this subject and you will answer again to tell him thank you bulldozer with some smilies of coffee, shawerma and a break dancer, bulldozer will answer back with Mar7aba Al Sa3 smily and tell you you are welcome, at night Surfer will log in and start his comments about fishing ... and you will answer him when you wake up in the morning to make fun about him and his muscels ... next day bulldozer will aslo write a comment .... don't you all agree on this guys?

Now poor Jeep lost an answer on his main question ..... Now Fearuae, can you tell me is that setup that Jeep is asking for good? do you have an advice? did you advice him or answered with a useful comment?

I liked the joke first time so I didn't comment, but now your discussion with bulldozer didn't stop so I thought I should stop both of you from hijacking

jeep · Post by **jeep** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 7:30 pm

one more thing , i just got to know from a friend that there is a shop in dubai selling optima batteries for like 375 dhs.
and the same friend is saying that they are very good and that he is using them in his dual system.

iguana · Post by **iguana** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 7:32 pm

As per my information, they are not good in this hot weather, but If you know someone that you tryst and he tried it, then go ahead

jeep · Post by **jeep** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 7:39 pm

yah he is saying the yellow optima is good for the hot weather.
now we are done with the battery, and waiting to know which wires and altenator with which amps to be used.
i sent the question to the guy in quadratec when he asnwers i'll post it.
hmmmm i thought that i'll find many guys usings such system.
maybe someone will ask why do we need it , well ok this is whats going on:

this is what I have installed on the car:

Winch 9.5 ton
Four KC sealed beam 150 w lights
Delta SkyBar Six 4.5” XENON and 330 maximum watts of lighting power
Tough Stuff® Lighting Kit with Six Optronics® Super White, Low-Profile, 55W Quartz-Halogen Driving Lights
KC Back-Up Light Kit with 55-Watt bulbs.
Sound system including 10 speakers and tweeters + one subwoofer 1400 w + three amplifiers.

as you can see this is a huge load so thats why i need to do the dual battery system, and if anyone of you is usings lots of lights and a winch and a sound system then i think he better think of getting a dual battery.

WildFire · Post by **WildFire** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 10:28 pm

OK,

I thought that the battery is used for Starting the engine and then the charging denamo ( dont know what its techinicaly named

) will take over supplaying electricety .... therefore , the battery is consumed if the engine is not running and a light or other electric device is used.

Can any one explane this :dontknow:

jeep · Post by **jeep** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 10:45 pm

yes the battery is used to start the engine and when the engine is running the battery is charging, however the battery is also running all the other electrical systems (lights, winch, sound system, coolers, cd player, tv) therefore you don't want to have a load from these electrical systems more than what the battery can handle otherwise the battery will die.
when you use the dual battery system , then the two batteries are charging when the engine is running and you get more power (electricity to run all the devices).

the key source of power when the vehicle is running is the alternator. the only time adding extra batteries is a good idea is if you want more listening time when the car is shut off. once the car is started it is the alternators job to recharge the battery(s),run the cars electrical system,accessories and any sound system components that have been added (amps).

The alternator of a:

compact car is about 35 amps
mid-sized car is about 65-75 amps
SUV is about 145 amps

Calculate 40% of the amperes of the alternator you have now. This is the average current the car uses when running. Add this number to the approximate average current draw of the amps, and you will come up with the actual size of alternator you need.

the truth is that the acceptance rate of your batteries will dictate how much amperage the alternator will provide. it is recommended that you try to size your alternator to represent 25% to 40% of your overall battery capacity.

WildFire · Post by **WildFire** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 11:03 pm

When you will get the extra electricety power , will the wires survive without being BBQed

or do you have to upgrade them as wel

iguana · Post by **iguana** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 11:03 pm

No Jeep, you go it wrong .... In the dual battery, you have the 2nd battery as an emergency battery .. when the first one die you use the 2nd one in emergency or if you are running all your electrical systems when the engine is switched off thats why you also get the dash switch when you get the dual battery ... this is to switch between one battery and the other so you will have one battery running all the time ...... To solve your problem you need a bigger altenator (charging dynamo) ... To understand wht I mean, start your engine, put all your lights on and start your music system on loud, you will see that the lights are shaking because the amount of electricity thatthe altenator charges is lower the the amount required to run all these things together .... so there is a lack of power which cause the shaking of lights ..... when you have a bigger altenator with higher amp that delivers more electricity, it will be enough ... I am not an electrical eng. but I think this is the solution to your problem ...

jeep · Post by **jeep** » Sat Jul 14, 2007 11:08 pm

iguana you didn't read it all

jeep · Post by **jeep** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 9:40 am

ok so this is the setup i ordered:

http://www.quadratec.com/products/55112_500.htm
http://www.quadratec.com/products/17003_02.htm
http://www.quadratec.com/products/17004_201.htm
http://www.quadratec.com/products/17004_302.htm

Dee See · Post by **Dee See** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 6:19 pm

In all of this thread I don't think I have seen you post the reason you wanted a dual battery set up in the first place.
There are a couple of different options available to you. One is the heavier duty option which is used for dual batteries used for winching and the other set up is for those people who want dual batteries for recreation, running fridges, stereos, camping lights etc.
Can you say for which application you want a pair of batteries?

I'd love to know who is selling Optima batteries for 375Dhs! I have twin Optimas on both my trucks and paid around 750Dhs each for them!
Optimas were originaly developed by NASA for use in outer space. I've never been that high but the gumph from Optima is that their batteries will withstand any temperature here on earth that the bateries could ever encounter under an engine bay. My first Optimas lasted 7 years! The latest set have been in the Disco for around two years and are still going strong (touch wood).

That link to Quadratec shows a constantly rated solenoid, some cable and a few bits of sheet steel. You could know up an exact duplicate split charger for around 400Dhs! Be sure to use a constantly rated solenoid and not a starter type which is wound for bursts of power from the ignition switch.
It's a basic system and very cheap to make.
The next step is a dual battery management system. These are made by Pirana etc and cost subsiquently more....around 1600Dhs.

Regards.

jeep · Post by **jeep** » Thu Jul 19, 2007 8:24 pm

for me i want it for everything winching and also running fridges, stereos, camping lights etc.

and for the optima batteries i was told that a shop is selling them in dubai near molla plazza , for me i'm ordering them from the states.

Dee See · Post by **Dee See** » Sun Jul 22, 2007 5:59 pm

Green meanie alternator = Good choice!

If you don't mind me asking...why are you getting the rest of the stuff from the States? I bought my Optimas from Summat Racing but I had the privelidge of free freight on an APO address. By the time you've forked out for fright you'll be out of pocket.

US$210 for the solenoid is a bit much though...you can buy the same for 125Dhs in Morse trading and then make your own loom with a three way switch and connectors.
US$ for the battery tray! Wow...I can see why the Auto Traders all drive around in nice expensive cars these days! I made a Dual tray from a sheet of 5mm aluminium and a 20Dhs set of battery clamps.

The slight problem with the system that you've bought is that a solenoid isn't intelegent enough to distribute the charging amps between the two different batteries. Hence the flattest of the two batteries will rob amps from the stronger one. This means the weaker of the two batteries dies prematurly.
An ideal solenoid charging system utterlizes two batteries of the same amperage. In other words...try to find a starter battery to co-exist with the deep cycle yellow top or go the whole hog and fit a dual battery management system which distributes the amps towards the battery that most needs it. A Pirana DBS 180S is a good unit and comes with a 5 year warranty. I think Icon Autos in Dubai sell them for around 1600Dhs.

Regards.

jeep · Post by **jeep** » Sun Jul 22, 2007 9:50 pm

thanx man for the tip , i'll check out icon for the management system.

iremy · Post by **iremy** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 10:18 am

Gents:

I have the dual battery system install in my car for about a year now, and work ok, no alternator upgrades (same as standard 100amps) the way this work it will only charge one battery at the time (primary then secundary) and draw power from one battery only when the engine is not running (secundary) that way if you have your fridge(for example) running all nigth you know your car will start the next morning.

The secondary battery only goes in line (parallel) is you choose (manual set up) or automaticlly (when wire that way) only when the voltage of the primary battery goes bellow 11 volts.

The system I use was the one sell by ARB in Mssf for a Toyota land cruiser rigth hand drive, but it works just fine, only need to cut here anther to fit the baterry tray.

Hope this info is helpfull.